This’ll get you upvotes from the people that agree with you but it’s almost like you’re not even trying to change my mind. You’re intentionally being vague and that doesn’t contribute anything to the discussion.
I think my question is pretty straight forward. The claim is that Warren Buffet has robbed others so he could become wealthy. I simply asked how does that work exactly. I’m not sure what my knowledge of Marx’s philosophy has to do with you being able to answer my question. If you have a good understanding of it yourself then it shouldn’t be too hard to explain it to an idiot like me.
The reason claims like this rubs me the wrong way is because what Warren Buffet is doing is hardly different from what I’m doing myself aswell. It’s just the scale that’s different. About half of my wealth is tied into stocks. Stocks that I’ve bought with my own money that I have earned with my own labour. I’ll never be able to become rich by working and I’m not going to become rich by investing either but that doesn’t mean I shouldn’t leverage the stock market to boost my own finances. The claim I hear you making here is that I’m essentially stealing from workers aswell.
EDIT: I asked chatGPT to steelman your position. This is what it said. Does this represent your view correctly?
When someone says “Ownership of Capital is theft from Workers” in a critical context of capitalism, they are likely expressing a viewpoint rooted in Marxist or socialist ideology. This statement reflects the belief that under capitalism, the ownership and control of capital (such as factories, land, machinery, etc.) by a relatively small group of individuals or entities (capitalists or owners) is inherently unjust because it deprives workers of the full value of their labor.
In Marxist theory, the means of production are considered to be collectively owned by society as a whole, and the capitalist system is seen as a mechanism through which the bourgeoisie (capitalist class) exploits the proletariat (working class) by extracting surplus value from their labor. According to this perspective, workers are only paid a portion of the value they produce, while the remainder is appropriated by the owners as profit.
From this viewpoint, the statement “Ownership of Capital is theft from Workers” suggests that the capitalist system is fundamentally exploitative, as it allows capitalists to profit from the labor of workers without adequately compensating them for their contributions. It highlights the unequal power dynamics inherent in capitalist societies, where a minority of individuals or corporations control the means of production and accumulate wealth at the expense of the majority who rely on selling their labor to survive.
It matters precisely because I need to know what I’m working with here. If you understand the concepts I asked about, I can pinpoint exactly where the robbery takes place. If not, then I have to try to explain those concepts in their most basic form.
You’re right, it isn’t too difficult to give you a brief overview, but without a firm understanding on your part it could open up far more questions than answer, unless you truly understand the basics of Marxism.
As for yourself, yes, you are ultimately stealing from Workers, but unfortunately that is the only way to actually retire in this Capitalist system without a pension or massive savings. The goal is to escape the Proletariat and join the bourgeoisie via steady Capital accumulation, and go from exploited to exploiter.
As for ChatGPT, it was broadly correct but was extremely vague and skipped over important details like the M-C-M’ circuit I mentioned earlier, the broad cycle by which Capitalists use a sum of Money M to pay people to create a commodity C and sell for a greater value M’. Asking ChatGPT about Marxism is going to result in a lot of missed details and risk misinformation.
Please explain me how this robbing works exactly.
Ownership of Capital is theft from Workers.
This’ll get you upvotes from the people that agree with you but it’s almost like you’re not even trying to change my mind. You’re intentionally being vague and that doesn’t contribute anything to the discussion.
Alright, then please, tell me how familiar you are with the following concepts and we can go from there.
Marx’s Law of Value
The M-C-M’ circuit
If you aren’t familiar with either, you’re truly better off reading Marx than getting a second-hand lecture, but I’ll do my best.
I think my question is pretty straight forward. The claim is that Warren Buffet has robbed others so he could become wealthy. I simply asked how does that work exactly. I’m not sure what my knowledge of Marx’s philosophy has to do with you being able to answer my question. If you have a good understanding of it yourself then it shouldn’t be too hard to explain it to an idiot like me.
The reason claims like this rubs me the wrong way is because what Warren Buffet is doing is hardly different from what I’m doing myself aswell. It’s just the scale that’s different. About half of my wealth is tied into stocks. Stocks that I’ve bought with my own money that I have earned with my own labour. I’ll never be able to become rich by working and I’m not going to become rich by investing either but that doesn’t mean I shouldn’t leverage the stock market to boost my own finances. The claim I hear you making here is that I’m essentially stealing from workers aswell.
EDIT: I asked chatGPT to steelman your position. This is what it said. Does this represent your view correctly?
It matters precisely because I need to know what I’m working with here. If you understand the concepts I asked about, I can pinpoint exactly where the robbery takes place. If not, then I have to try to explain those concepts in their most basic form.
You’re right, it isn’t too difficult to give you a brief overview, but without a firm understanding on your part it could open up far more questions than answer, unless you truly understand the basics of Marxism.
As for yourself, yes, you are ultimately stealing from Workers, but unfortunately that is the only way to actually retire in this Capitalist system without a pension or massive savings. The goal is to escape the Proletariat and join the bourgeoisie via steady Capital accumulation, and go from exploited to exploiter.
As for ChatGPT, it was broadly correct but was extremely vague and skipped over important details like the M-C-M’ circuit I mentioned earlier, the broad cycle by which Capitalists use a sum of Money M to pay people to create a commodity C and sell for a greater value M’. Asking ChatGPT about Marxism is going to result in a lot of missed details and risk misinformation.