I condemn the use of slurs. Ask me that question again, I defy you to make me give you the same answer to the same question.

This is not an allyship by any stretch of the imagination.

Then you have a severely limited imagination and an equally dismal knowledge of history beyond the past century. Does the small things the church has tried to do to mend all the awful things they’ve done? Not even close, frankly I’m not satisfied they’ve even begun to redeem themselves for the inquisition and they likely may never in my lifetime. Likely not yours or in a thousand or in a million but they might one day. That small infinitesimal chance is the same as life forming on Earth. I’m hedging my bets on the house.

I’d condemn them.

This is what is irrelevant to my point. It’s not about how you judge others it’s about how others would judge you. Based on your logic of judging others harshly for the action of those that came before, you would be judged severely. Worry not for many would burn with you, myself included.

There’s never been an excuse for such behavior.

No but there’s been an infinite number of rationalizations used for it. Until humanity collectively became better and continues to do so it was a fact of life. Not an excuse just acceptance of reality.

I’m only judging the church and its shitty pope based on their actual words and actions.

Are you though? Because you seem reactionary only to what is in front of you. Not on the totality of human history nor through any perspective beyond your own do you seem to be making your decisions.

They’re still an active hate group in 2024.

Yes they are but I can’t say for sure that they will tomorrow. Even if tomorrow they still are, still doesn’t answer for the day after or the one after that and ad infinitum until reality ends and no more chances for redemption could be had.

This is where you and I simply will not agree. I believe that everyone is worthy of redemption. What actually earns redemption is far beyond my point and what an organization as long and old as these fuckers would have to do truly stretches the imagination but it’s not an impossibility. I cannot judge what redeems others because I cannot judge what redeems me. All I know is that trying to be better today than yesterday has to be worth something.

Also, not appreciating you downplaying the fact that the Catholic church clearly believes LGBTQIA+ is a sin.

Is that what that wiki page you presented and I quoted for you says to you? Because to me it says that opinions are split and change couldn’t come soon enough but it’s coming as fast as it can. If that isn’t good enough for you then that is your own personal problem.

In March 2021, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith said that the church cannot bless same-sex relationships because “God cannot bless sin”.[6]On 18 December 2023, it published Fiducia supplicans, a declaration allowing Catholic priests to bless people who are not considered to be married by the Church, including same-sex couples.[7]

The church provides pastoral care for LGBT Catholics through a variety of official and unofficial channels that vary from diocese to diocese, and senior clergy and popes have recently begun to call for the church to do more. In many parts of the world, the Church is active politically on issues of LGBT rights. The relationship between the Catholic Church and the LGBT community has been a difficult one, especially during the height of the AIDS crisis, and World War II Nazi Germany.[8]

Pope Francis was the first pope to support same-sex civil unions as legal protections for same-sex couples.[9][10] He has denounced laws criminalising homosexuality.[11][12][13]

Dang if only you had read the full article.

You know it’s real easy to judge others for the sins of their fathers. How far into your family history would we need to dig to judge you for the rape or murders your forebears likely committed?

Now I know all about Catholic doctrine having been raised in the faith. And first hand I have experienced their brand of hate, it was both taught to me and turned against me when I came out the closet. For a long time after I was ousted from that community I let that hate fester my every waking thought. It wasn’t until those feelings actually killed me and I came back from the other side that I realized how stupid the whole thing was. Hating those who hated me only produced more hate in the world.

I let go of the pain I felt by no longer wanting others to feel how I did.

Judging people on their words and their beliefs is the same discrimination you say to hate. Doing it to people who do it to you doesn’t magically make you right and them wrong, it’s always wrong.

So I will repeat myself, I condemn the use of slurs.

Condemn the usage of slurs? Easy and always.

But as for actually judging people only based on what they say or what others said they said? That’s for republicunts and religious idiots.

In the same way that 3000 year old stories are not sufficient evidence for people to believe in god, so are a couple news articles about words behind closed doors not enough evidence to condemn a man.

Not wanting people to die is not a defense of who they are. It’s simply not wishing death on others.

If it was that simple it would have been done already. In fact it’s been done multiple times, burning people doesn’t burn away the problem. Hate doesn’t need god, it simply exists as part of humanity. But by all means keep shouting that the elimination of people is the solution to the problem, real popular in Zionism these days you fit right in with them.

Why stop just at him? If death and destruction is how you get your kicks then why not hope for the elimination of an entire people too? If you get rid of all the Catholics and religious people do you think you will get rid of all the hate? What about all the people who don’t need to hate in the name of god, like you?

Only been about 20 years since the push against using slurs. It’s shocking now to watch movies from 2010 and earlier because it’s so prevalent. How far we’ve come as far as respecting other people really obscures how long it really has been.

Really was an honest mistake, I didn’t find out she had mixed up the slur and word for larva of order Diptera until I audited her teaching class. The other educator with me didn’t even react and told me she had been doing it for as long as she knew her. Not her students, not the parents or other teachers ever bothered to correct her. She loved teaching about the life cycle of flies but her fear of accidentally slipping a slur killed that passion.

I’m not apologizing for the pope nor bigots at large. Just saying that there are circumstances in which someone who appears to be one thing isn’t, and you should be suspicious of being told what someone else looks like if you can’t see for yourself.

This is just bad science. Did your dad and grandad also speak multiple languages and belong to an organization that has splintered into factions, some of which whose purpose is to try to destroy all good will and faith built with marginalized communities?

My mom at least speaks multiple languages and for over 20 years of knowing English she thought that maggot was the slur and the word with the hard f sound that rhymes with maggot was the acceptable one to say. It wasn’t until I corrected her behavior did she actually know it was wrong. She will still drop the f-word because the word association has been long since made but at least she apologizes and corrects herself now.

See now we have conflicting anecdotes and the glaring question gets ignored.

Cui bono?

Nah I’ll blame everyone else, I wasn’t counting on them anyway.

If the part that’s going to be pissed off is less than what could be won then is the risk worth taking? Some campaign manager must have thought so or this appeal against his own base is a terrible gamble.

I find his base to be largely split on this issue. There’s the bleeding hearts who cry for amnesty (Sky Daddy bless their souls) and the at best ambivalent and at worst lipstick racist others.

I’m definitely coming off as a fatalist and alarmist but I firmly believe there is a path forward that includes all of us. Just the cost will be severe and unexpected, I hope we’re ready. And while my natural inclination is that of least resistance and less pain, I hope it is achievable within our generations. Let us bear the brunt of braving a new world that our children and their children’s children know better lives than we do.

Take it and spread it hopefully further than just the fediverse. Or make your own and pass along the good word

https://lemmy.ca/post/16418854

Here’s the post I saw that inspired my own.

If I had a nickel for every time someone unwittingly became the face of something humorous we can all relate to, well I’d at least have a nickel more than what this job presumably paid her.

Good springboards today. Lemmy is starting to feel more alive don’t you think?

In all seriousness thank you for taking the time for a moral obligation. All things should be tempered and while humor is a great tool to distort the truth it should never completely obstruct it.

At the very least, here’s to trying to draw attention to your comment.

Capitalism is mass produced feudalism distilled in just enough high fructose corn syrup to sell the lie to the people that if you work hard enough and pull up your straps all the way, one day you will be the one pulling the strings and not licking boots. The problem isn’t in facing this stark reality, it’s in having enough imagination to see what could lay beyond the comforting pain of what you are used to and the devil you don’t know.

People are not ready for a complete societal overhaul, I am not ready for it either but we’re speeding along to a future where people will know the bitter taste of their neighbor’s flesh in the name of survival. I hope to be spared such knowledge and for other good people to be too but here we are, entire populations around the world are about die of thirst and we’ve let people (because corpos are people as legally defined for the purposes of money in some places and might as well drop the facade in others) bottle and sell it as a commodity and a premium at that.

For those still reading and capable of abstract thought: imagine you were an entity composed of gas and you discovered a species composed of up to 60% water willingly slave away for clean access. Insanity.

Stranger than fiction though, we can all start boiling our tap water to reduce up to 90% of microplastics (phys.org). Seems like the cosmic jokes on us. Good thing I guess that we’re boiling our planet alive, that way the ultra rich doomsday-prepped assholes who have allowed this design to come to fruition will have everything they want after the manufactured cataclysm wipes the rest of us out.

TLDR; I went off on a tinfoiled rant.