• SpiceDealer@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    2 days ago

    (Mass dislikes time!)

    Yes, the US does evil shit in the Middle East. Killing brown-skinned practitioners of the other Abrahamic religion overseas is an American tradition.

    That still doesn’t change the fact that China is persecuting Uyghurs in the Xinjiang province.

    You can’t shit-talk one authoritarian state and cheer on another.

    • Evilsandwichman [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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      1 day ago

      That still doesn’t change the fact that China is persecuting Uyghurs in the Xinjiang province.

      But it’s not a fact though? You can’t imagine up some fictional scenario and then just claim it’s a fact; words have meanings

    • TankieTanuki [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      2 days ago

      If not reeducation, which method would you prefer China use to combat the foreign radical Wahhabism and terrorism spread by the CIA in Xinjiang for the purpose of regional destabilization and regime change?

      We all know how the US chose to implement its own war on terror. Muslim majority countries in the Middle East support China’s method.

    • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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      2 days ago

      That still doesn’t change the fact that China is persecuting Uyghurs in the Xinjiang province.

      Previously:

      The US tried to foment division in China by funding and organizing Salafi terrorist into Xinjiang, and once its efforts failed, it made lemonade out of its lemon by concocting and promoting a genocide narrative.

      The only countries pushing this narrative are the “always the same mapimperial core countries, which just so happen to be largely the same ones supporting Israel’s genocide.

      Almost no predominantly-Muslim country buys the Uyghur genocide narrative, because they know it’s bullshit, because they talked to the Uyghurs themselves.
      https://twitter.com/un_hrc/status/1578003299827171330 #HRC51 | Draft resolution A/HRC/51/L.6 on holding a debate on the situation of human rights in the Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region of #China, was REJECTED.

      • TankieTanuki [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        1 day ago

        The US tried to foment division in China by funding and organizing Salafi terrorist into Xinjiang, and once its efforts failed, it made lemonade out of its lemon by concocting and promoting a genocide narrative.

        Much like how after China foiled their color revolution attempt in 1989, the CIA had to pivot to the “Tinyman Square Massacre” narrative.

        • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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          1 day ago

          Very much like that, and they’re still getting mileage out of it with no effort, because Lemmitors get an endorphin rush every time they do the CIA’s work for free, the brave defenders of freedom & democracy that they are 🤦‍♂️

      • tyler@programming.dev
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        1 day ago

        Sources:

        • china news propaganda site
        • medium article from rando
        • project syndicate link which is an op-ed site (not news)
        • a wiki page from an incredibly biased group
        • a youtube link…
        • a site calling itself a news site, yet no actual credentials, but seems to be associated with China (Ajit Singh has written Chinese propaganda books)
        • a substack link

        This has to be the least compelling list of evidence one could provide, and yet you get upvotes because it looks like you’ve provided proof of something. All you’ve done is provide a lot of incredibly, seriously biased opinions with no actual facts at all.

        • BrainInABox@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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          1 day ago

          As opposed to all those unbiased sources you’ve provided, lol.

          • tyler@programming.dev
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            1 day ago

            I’m absolutely not going to provide sources or even argue with anyone from .ml on an .ml community because it’s pointless. You all do not care about proper sourcing and think it’s even a detractor because it’s “western”. I’m pointing out the problems with the sources for all the other people that are observing that comment and being swayed, because it’s a bunch of baloney.

            • DupaCycki@lemmy.world
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              1 day ago

              Disclaimer: not .ml.

              Critisizing someone’s sources and then refusing to provide any other ones “because it’s pointless” seems a little hypocritical to me.

              I’m pointing out the problems with the sources for all the other people that are observing that comment and being swayed, because it’s a bunch of baloney.

              So we should trust your word over someone’s who has at least put in the effort to provide sources?

              Look, you don’t need to prove anything, but if you’re gonna argue or act like you’re defending people from misinformation, then I’d expect to see more than just “don’t listen to that guy”. It’s not exactly easy finding objective information about various issues in China and filtering out all the American propaganda. Personally, I’d very much appreciate any links that don’t lead to obvious manipulation.

              • tyler@programming.dev
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                19 hours ago

                If someone claims to solve string theory and then provides shit sources there is never an obligation to provide sources that solve string theory. Pointing out sources are shit is part of science. I don’t need to provide a counter argument because that’s not the purpose of the conversation. I don’t need to provide proof of the alternative because the only thing I’m trying to accomplish is to stop this liar from spreading misinformation.

                A lie can travel around the world before the truth takes a few steps. That’s exactly what that user is trying to do. Post as many lies as possible so that refuting them takes hours if not days if not months or years.

                • DupaCycki@lemmy.world
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                  15 hours ago

                  How can you know if the sources really are bad if it’s not obvious aftet reading? Do you just trust a random person’s words? In this case, you’re essentially arbitrarily picking one version over another.

                  The problem with ‘stopping lies’ is it requires effort, which not everyone may wish to dedicate. I’m by no means denouncing the other person for trying to stop misinformation (assuming that’s the case, since I still have no idea). However, it’s all in vain if they don’t bother to do anything to prove their point.

                  Anyone can post misinformation as sources, just as anyone can post that the sources are bad. Fundamentally there isn’t a whole lot of difference between the two. If you really feel the need to defend people from being misinformed, some better source or other form of proof, or at the very least a deeper explanation would go a long way.

                • RiverRock@lemmy.ml
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                  18 hours ago

                  So like

                  If someone claims there’s totally a genocide

                  Then provides shit sources…

                  🤔

            • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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              1 day ago

              You’re conflating “proper sourcing” with being western, that’s already an error, and second of all it’s the west that has been most prominently pushing the genocide theory. Of course it’s going to be contested by China. The validity of sources used by posts on YouTube and Medium aren’t in question because of where they are hosted, they are often hosted on these kinds of platforms because opposing western narratives gets you blacklisted.

              • tyler@programming.dev
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                19 hours ago

                If that were true then non western sources would have plenty of news articles, yet all ml users post are things directly from Russia or China or “alternative” “sources” like medium (which isn’t a source). There are plenty of regimes that do not align with anything America has to say, yet no news articles from them.

                • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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                  19 hours ago

                  Not really true. We post sources from all over, especially groups like Al Mayadeen that post in English. If we post something in spanish from Granma, for example, people can’t read that.

        • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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          1 day ago

          Wow, I wonder why there aren’t any Western corporate media sources with a Media Bias/Fact Check seal of approval…

          Previously:

          The first step is to understand the media, which Media Bias/Fact Check and the Ad Fontes Media* are never going to teach you. The only people who are taught it are those who get degrees in marketing, public relations, political science, history, and journalism; and even then only some of them.

          The new post-Trump/“post-truth” media literacy curricula won’t teach it to you either, because it was paid for and crafted by the US military-industrial complex: New Media Literacy Standards Aim to Combat ‘Truth Decay’.

          This week, the RAND Corporation released a new set of media literacy standards designed to support schools in this task.

          The standards are part of RAND’s ongoing project on “truth decay”: a phenomenon that RAND researchers describe as “the diminishing role that facts, data, and analysis play in our political and civic discourse.”

          None of it is a secret, though, and it can be learned.


          * I’ve criticized MBFC & Ad Fontes before:

          • tyler@programming.dev
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            1 day ago

            Nobody said anything about MBFC. Good luck, like I said in another comment I’m not going to argue with anyone from .ml. I was pointing out the faults in your sources because they’re not proper sources no matter what region of the world you’re from.

        • nyctre@lemmy.worldBanned from community
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          1 day ago

          You’re arguing with a guy that doesn’t want to change their mind. He literally sent me a video whose sources contradicted him and guess what happened when I pointed that to him? Never bothered to reply and he still uses that video as proof that he’s right.

          • BrainInABox@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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            1 day ago

            As opposed to you people, who are totally open and eager to change your minds

            • nyctre@lemmy.worldBanned from community
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              1 day ago

              Seeing as how I actually watched his video and looked at their sources and other sources and only after that did I reply? Yes. And even to this day I still leave room for doubt. I still think the truth is actually somewhere in the middle. Not you, tho. You’re convinced that what you believe is correct.

              • BrainInABox@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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                1 day ago

                Not you, tho. You’re convinced that what you believe is correct.

                Yeah, as opposed to believing what I believe is incorrect…

                Do you even understand the concept of other minds?

                  • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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                    1 day ago

                    let’s not pretend your argument is any better than the previous one which got deleted within minutes lol.

                    What previous argument that “got deleted within minutes lol”? See this is why Lemmy’s modlog is public.

    • robot_dog_with_gun [they/them]@hexbear.net
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      2 days ago

      this post isn’t cheering on china, it’s shitting on the west’s hypocrisy.

      also you might want to look up who funded the wahabis who groomed the terrorists that the crackdown is a response to.

      • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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        2 days ago

        “Authoritarian state” is a bullshit category. Authoritarian states are just states insufficiently subservient to Washington. It’s no more or less coherent than “terrorist state,” which the US uses in the same way.

        “Authoritarianism” is the contemporary word for “totalitarianism,” which is just an erudite-seming term for horseshoe theory, which is horseshit. Previously:

      • MDCCCLV@lemmy.ca
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        1 day ago

        I thought I’d blocked ml already. Guess I need to do that again.

          • MDCCCLV@lemmy.ca
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            15 hours ago

            Blocking ml is a frequent topic of discussion, as it’s widely considered to be propaganda unconnected to reality.

        • BrainInABox@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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          1 day ago

          To liberals, “simping so fucking hard” literally just means, "not believing literally every piece of propaganda that right wing western propaganda outlets pump out about them.

          If they were old enough to be paying attention in 2002, they would be accusing anyone who didn’t believe Iraq had WMDs of “simping so fucking hard” for Saddam.

          • Oppopity@lemmy.ml
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            1 day ago

            You don’t believe there are WMD? What are you some authoritarian simping tankie?

            • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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              1 day ago

              🤣 Their jabs are so far off the mark, but every time they think they’ve hit the bullseye. If they could see our fremdschämen faces…

    • BrainInABox@lemmy.mlBanned from community
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      2 days ago

      "Yes, the US does evil shit in the Middle East. Killing brown-skinned practitioners of the other Abrahamic religion overseas is an American tradition.

      That still doesn’t change the fact that Iraq is building weapons of mass destruction to attack the USA.

      You can’t shit-talk one authoritarian state and cheer on another."

      Seriously, how many times do you need to hear it before you western chauvanists realise it’s not about “good or bad”, it’s about trustworthy or untrustworthy.